update to civillian rights discussion

[Atryus]

so look, Normally I keep to myself about these things but This is a Meme at this point and needs serious discussion and change.

So essentially in a gun fight if cops run out of ammo, they can take guns and ammo off of criminals to keep fighting. Does no one understand the issue with this? Cops already have a mass advantage in numbers, They get free guns which have been proven to be better than what Civs can get multiple times, And now if they want to they can take our guns and ammo. But what about crims? What happens when we run out of ammo? We are shit out of luck because we cant take a single thing off LEO, Cant take guns, cant take armor, nothing. This is SO one sided its like y'all not even trying to keep things balanced anymore. Every day there is more and more people here about certain LEO's abusing powers to fuck people over in a game and as a response yall give them the ability to shoot criminals without a gun because they deem them as a threat. Was the DoJ even consulted about these changes? because I really honestly believe this is LEO making their own rules and something has to change because this is honestly causing so much unneeded drama in server soon PD will have to be policing AI because Crims will just not see the value in continuing Crim RP. I know a lot of this comes off as harsh but the whole skating around it and speaking about it indirectly is how we got to this place. Please keep it as civil as possible I purposely did not call anyone out directly because its not needed we are all OOC very well aware of the issues brought up here.

[Timr]

The intent of that exemption doesn't relate to using criminal weapons when LEOs run out of ammo, it relates to the fact that by definition, LEO carbines and tazers are both illegal. This exemption allows them to use these weapons without fear of being prosecuted.

LEO use of weapons is dictated by their SOPs, and if the situation you described actually happens it should be IA'd.

[Atryus]

See I don't see why it needs clarification on account the weapons are issued to LEO's by the state, no one thinks that an officer using an AR is illegal, all this does is open the avenue for interpretation. As far as IA goes, I'm not even sure there is an IA, People are put in prison with no paperwork, I've seen LEO Pit a motorcycle, Seen LEO's pull and use AR's on low level threats who had pistols and sometimes unarmed countless times,  Officers shoot people down then outright refuse them medical. If an IA is out there Im sorry but they are not paying attention to whats going on. How far do things need to go before someone stops it? Look at how North Yankton is handled, 50k for a speeding ticket, instantly shooting with ARs if someone runs, I would say this should be a polar opposite to what people deal with in the main city but honestly people talk about how they can see it happening. I have watched the criminal element slowly die since I have come into the city. Banks are barely hit anymore compared to what they were, crim to crim fights have come to an almost stand still because its just not worth it with the state of cops, and its devolved into Crims just going to war with cops. I know i'm not the only one who sees the state of things and is concerned where its going.

Edit: and dont take this as me shitting on any side of things, Im aware some crims more than skate the line and they also need to be dealt with.

Edited December 15, 2021 by Atryus

[Timr]

These points were added for the same reason that the other emergency services exemptions were added. If they don't exist, people question why the Police SOPs override the civilian rights.

I can assure you that IAs are definitely a thing and definitely get actioned, but if nobody puts in IAs, how can any action be taken?

North Yankton is not a good place to draw opinions from because it is, and is intended to be, a police state. If you don't break the law then you're fine. If you do break the law, the police have no rules. It is meant to be a farce and many people are treating it that way and enjoying it. You, as a crim, can get away with a hell of a lot more in NY than you can in SA.

[Erwin]

19 hours ago, Atryus said:

Look at how North Yankton is handled, 50k for a speeding ticket, instantly shooting with ARs if someone runs, I would say this should be a polar opposite to what people deal with in the main city but honestly people talk about how they can see it happening.

Quick question for you. Have you actually been arrested in north yankton yet? I have. I got what was suppose to be 46k, instead it was 450. I don't think they are actually charging the actual amounts. North Yankton is suppose to be a fun meme, and it really is and honestly I hope it sticks all year. 

 

The one part about the update I am a bit confused about is this: 

1. An individual is observed openly carrying a hunting rifle within the hunting grounds (the green area defined on this map)

So does this mean anyone who is in the hunting area can be searched? Like obviously I know we can ask them for their license but if seen with a hunting rifle in the hunting area that means they can be detained and searched? or was this suppose to say outside the hunting grounds?

[dK_]

Anyone that is perceived to be hunting in the hunting grounds is subject to be searched. It doesn’t mean they have be searched though. And it definitely doesn’t mean they need to be detained. 

Edited December 16, 2021 by Richie Jax

[Timr]

That clause was added to allow hunting spot checks. The reward for poaching is high, so this risk offsets it 

[Erwin]

1 hour ago, Timr said:

That clause was added to allow hunting spot checks. The reward for poaching is high, so this risk offsets it 

That is what I thought, just wanted to make it clarified thank you Timr

[UnknownRNGS]

On 12/14/2021 at 11:39 PM, Atryus said:

See I don't see why it needs clarification on account the weapons are issued to LEO's by the state, no one thinks that an officer using an AR is illega

Homie, you would be surprised

[Josie]

On 12/14/2021 at 9:57 PM, Atryus said:

so look, Normally I keep to myself about these things but This is a Meme at this point and needs serious discussion and change.

So essentially in a gun fight if cops run out of ammo, they can take guns and ammo off of criminals to keep fighting. Does no one understand the issue with this? Cops already have a mass advantage in numbers, They get free guns which have been proven to be better than what Civs can get multiple times, And now if they want to they can take our guns and ammo. But what about crims? What happens when we run out of ammo? We are shit out of luck because we cant take a single thing off LEO, Cant take guns, cant take armor, nothing. This is SO one sided its like y'all not even trying to keep things balanced anymore. Every day there is more and more people here about certain LEO's abusing powers to fuck people over in a game and as a response yall give them the ability to shoot criminals without a gun because they deem them as a threat. Was the DoJ even consulted about these changes? because I really honestly believe this is LEO making their own rules and something has to change because this is honestly causing so much unneeded drama in server soon PD will have to be policing AI because Crims will just not see the value in continuing Crim RP. I know a lot of this comes off as harsh but the whole skating around it and speaking about it indirectly is how we got to this place. Please keep it as civil as possible I purposely did not call anyone out directly because its not needed we are all OOC very well aware of the issues brought up here.

Just wanted to give a little input that there's something called Qualified immunity IRL that this is basically a in-game translation of to a degree. So that's not to say that a cop won't ever be found as acting outside of reasonable execution of duties, and any prior rulings in similar situations would mean the cop would be held accountable if that makes sense. I know there's plenty of questionable cops around, and there's questionable crims too. I don't think there will ever be a perfect and "fair" balance, because there will always be differing views. This addition/edit to the civilian rights is pretty common, I think it could probably just use a little more clarification so there's no confusion.

 

Also, NYSP are a bunch of drunk trolls, honestly lol.

[Dorkyartist]

On 12/14/2021 at 10:57 PM, Atryus said:

so look, Normally I keep to myself about these things but This is a Meme at this point and needs serious discussion and change.

So essentially in a gun fight if cops run out of ammo, they can take guns and ammo off of criminals to keep fighting. Does no one understand the issue with this? Cops already have a mass advantage in numbers, They get free guns which have been proven to be better than what Civs can get multiple times, And now if they want to they can take our guns and ammo. But what about crims? What happens when we run out of ammo? We are shit out of luck because we cant take a single thing off LEO, Cant take guns, cant take armor, nothing. This is SO one sided its like y'all not even trying to keep things balanced anymore. Every day there is more and more people here about certain LEO's abusing powers to fuck people over in a game and as a response yall give them the ability to shoot criminals without a gun because they deem them as a threat. Was the DoJ even consulted about these changes? because I really honestly believe this is LEO making their own rules and something has to change because this is honestly causing so much unneeded drama in server soon PD will have to be policing AI because Crims will just not see the value in continuing Crim RP. I know a lot of this comes off as harsh but the whole skating around it and speaking about it indirectly is how we got to this place. Please keep it as civil as possible I purposely did not call anyone out directly because its not needed we are all OOC very well aware of the issues brought up here.

If these things do happen I suggest having it recorded and sending it in with a ticket. Also, if the cops do wrong you in city, you can sue the department by going to the DOJ. It’s not the department of JUSTICE for nothing, as it’s justice for both sides!