Scuba kit - weights and time

[Merr Khan]

Not that i want to make a suggestion that will hinder the law biding citizens more, but I had a thought that would help correct the illegal use of Scuba gear, while having a small hindrance on the legal side.

So my thought was if Scuba kits can, 

1: Takes time to put on, maybe a forced emote, and can't be in a vehicle or moving while doing it. 

2: Weighs a bit more like a real scuba kit, I know for sure that I would not be running around with 5+ scuba kits on me, I doubt I'd be able to move. so like 20 kgs each.

 

Now these two idea's in my mind will strongly punish those that like to carry a Scuba kit 24/7, (with no intentions of diving for gold), they can still carry that scuba kit but at a cost. (Inventory space)

For the set up time , and hopefully forced emote, you can't just put it on while driving your car off the pier. This Won't stop the legal users from putting it on while on a boat. 

 

Anyway just my $.02  
 

Edited August 28, 2018 by Merr Khan

[ImVexal]

Amen! Haven't gotten around to making a post yet but yes! This is needed. I'm sick of chasing people in car chases that lead to them throwing there car into the water then diving away... Yes we can use our "Detective", skills to find them but in a real instance you ain't going to be carrying a Scuba Kit in your back pocket. I would reconsider the carry weight of a Scuba Kit or have it so if they enter a vehicle the kit is destroyed and they can't equipt in vehicle(s)

[Tomas García]

Yesterday was the first time I tried the diving in the wreck areas. But the idea of it could be used to run away from police came to my head. And sure it's there.

In a way, like a parachute, it could be another valid option to get away, if it was planned. Certainly carrying the kit 24/7 is a bit OP. But there are also small bottles for the mouth that last 10 minutes in RL. That's not so crazy to be carried around if you compare it with a full scuba kit. And it's more or less the time it gives in game 15 minutes. So... I think this is more like the issue with cars and people wanting RL speeds. Should it be allowed or limited to use the scuba as a run away method for police? As it is is a bit OP and a cop taking a scuba kit and doing the same feels odd and crazy RP wise, unless they go for a boat first which could have the gear for them.

Emote- or delay to put on while been steady in place without been in a vehicle (it should include be floating on water surface to, since that's the main legal way of using it). Idea by @Merr Khan seems quite reasonable and good for everyone.

Weight - @Merr Khan idea is nice but don't agree. Since that will impact a bit negatively to those that use the scuba for what it's meant. Since yesterday I did 3 wreck places solo and with more weight per kit would fill up the boat, which mean that if it was with a friend or two, we couldn't share a boat just for weight reasons. (Remember you need weight too to carry what you pick up).
 

2 hours ago, ImVexal said:

 I'm sick of chasing people in car chases that lead to them throwing there car into the water then diving away...

I'm still a bit rusty about how the server works, since there has been so many nice changes since I was around. But on this one, I would say that PD should have tools to simply seize any vehicle used in that way. After all a car in the water would be just useless after that in RL. And charges should stay on the character owner of the vehicle if that one hadn't report it stolen prior to the incident.
So about this point either crimes stay in record or there should be a direct punishment for doing such like the seize.


So to wrap up. I think this post fits more the tittle of "Scuba kits as runaway tool". And sure it's valid, but any changes should be focused on making more fair that use of the scuba gear without impacting negatively to the real use of it.
 

[errorlink]

You're looking at this from cop perspective not the intended use.

[ImVexal]

21 minutes ago, errorlink said:

You're looking at this from cop perspective not the intended use.

People aren't using them as they are intended for either or sorry a majority? They were implemented as apart of the diving update to allow people to make money not to assist them in throwing there selves of a bridge in their bid to escape cops

Edited August 28, 2018 by ImVexal
Additional notes

[errorlink]

I'm sorry but every server that has scuba kits use them to get away, it's not against server rules either.

Just expect it. Don't punish the people using it as intended because of a few shitlords.

If they keep doing it and you're recording report them for disruptive behavior and see what the admins say.

[ImVexal]

22 minutes ago, Tomas García said:

Yesterday was the first time I tried the diving in the wreck areas. But the idea of it could be used to run away from police came to my head. And sure it's there.

In a way, like a parachute, it could be another valid option to get away, if it was planned. Certainly carrying the kit 24/7 is a bit OP. But there are also small bottles for the mouth that last 10 minutes in RL. That's not so crazy to be carried around if you compare it with a full scuba kit. And it's more or less the time it gives in game 15 minutes. So... I think this is more like the issue with cars and people wanting RL speeds. Should it be allowed or limited to use the scuba as a run away method for police? As it is is a bit OP and a cop taking a scuba kit and doing the same feels odd and crazy RP wise, unless they go for a boat first which could have the gear for them.

Emote- or delay to put on while been steady in place without been in a vehicle (it should include be floating on water surface to, since that's the main legal way of using it). Idea by @Merr Khan seems quite reasonable and good for everyone.

Weight - @Merr Khan idea is nice but don't agree. Since that will impact a bit negatively to those that use the scuba for what it's meant. Since yesterday I did 3 wreck places solo and with more weight per kit would fill up the boat, which mean that if it was with a friend or two, we couldn't share a boat just for weight reasons. (Remember you need weight too to carry what you pick up).
 

I'm still a bit rusty about how the server works, since there has been so many nice changes since I was around. But on this one, I would say that PD should have tools to simply seize any vehicle used in that way. After all a car in the water would be just useless after that in RL. And charges should stay on the character owner of the vehicle if that one hadn't report it stolen prior to the incident.
So about this point either crimes stay in record or there should be a direct punishment for doing such like the seize.


So to wrap up. I think this post fits more the tittle of "Scuba kits as runaway tool". And sure it's valid, but any changes should be focused on making more fair that use of the scuba gear without impacting negatively to the real use of it.
 

I don't see why it needs be retitled as this still follows up on the suggestion. This isn't a "general" discussion but a suggestion on how it can be balanced for those who use them for their intended use and for those who use the malicious

[errorlink]

Only way they could balance is increase the weight and up the scuba pricing.

But that still won't keep them from carrying 1 tank at all times.

It won't change anything.

Reggie has been a cop for 9 months and never came across this issue, myself I haven't either.

I don't think it's as big as a problem as people are making it.

You should be complaining more about parachutes and asking admins to increase the price to like  5k on those instead since people are using them at cocaine.

[ImVexal]

2 minutes ago, errorlink said:

I'm sorry but every server that has scuba kits use them to get away, it's not against server rules either.

Just expect it. Don't punish the people using it as intended because of a few shitlords.

If they keep doing it and you're recording report them for disruptive behavior and see what the admins say.

I have no issue with them evading in water... That's not the issue... This issue is that they have it equitpted or equip it in a vehicle and throw the car off the edge. 

The suggestion being is that like other things we try prevent this by either destroying the kits on entry to a vehicle or have it so it requires an emote - There are so many suggestions which can battle it whilst not effecting the people who use them how they were originally intended.

 

Another suggestion could be able to remove the kits so they can be stored in a vehicle.

 

Yes this maybe from a cops perspective but it's still a valid reason that needs to be seen to.

[ImVexal]

1 minute ago, errorlink said:

Only way they could balance is increase the weight and up the scuba pricing.

But that still won't keep them from carrying 1 tank at all times.

It won't change anything.

Reggie has been a cop for 9 months and never came across this issue, myself I haven't either.

I don't think it's as big as a problem as people are making it.

You should be complaining more about parachutes and asking admins to increase the price to like  5k on those instead since people are using them at cocaine.

Well there we go?, You haven't experienced my issue and I haven't experienced your coke issue...  Wether or not you have experiences this issue still persists with other officers

[errorlink]

1 minute ago, ImVexal said:

I have no issue with them evading in water... That's not the issue... This issue is that they have it equitpted or equip it in a vehicle and throw the car off the edge. 

The suggestion being is that like other things we try prevent this by either destroying the kits on entry to a vehicle or have it so it requires an emote - There are so many suggestions which can battle it whilst not effecting the people who use them how they were originally intended.

 

Another suggestion could be able to remove the kits so they can be stored in a vehicle.

 

Yes this maybe from a cops perspective but it's still a valid reason that needs to be seen to.

Making it so that you can't put it on in a car would work. Also the animation there isn't one for a scuba tank.

But I still have to disagree  that this isn't a big enough issue for them to change.

Plus you can only carry about 10 kits they weight a lot already.

[errorlink]

I'm going to say this and it's not meant to be rude but you win some you lose some.

Cops complaining about everything someone does to get away that's different shouldn't be happening

In the end this is a game.

The server already favors the cops heavy due to it being a public server,

There's criminals out there in the game and they are going to be creative and they are going to get away.

[ImVexal]

11 minutes ago, errorlink said:

I'm going to say this and it's not meant to be rude but you win some you lose some.

Cops complaining about everything someone does to get away that's different shouldn't be happening

In the end this is a game.

The server already favors the cops heavy due to it being a public server,

There's criminals out there in the game and they are going to be creative and they are going to get away.

Sure.

[vDrop]

I'm sorry @errorlink , I would disagree with you on this one. Mainly because as a Cop, I've witnessed the act quite a few times. Mainly not by shit lords either, by experienced long timers on the server. There's another title for those type. 

I don't see how this would punish the legal portion of doing Scuba Diving at all. 

- (1) Carry one scuba gear
- (2) Put additional Scuba Gear directly in your boat. 

The only thing it'll prevent is being able to scuba dive for multiple hours grinding away. I would agree with @ImVexal , you or Reggie may not have experienced it, but many other officers have. Is it a major issue? No, but its something that can be tweaked to find tune the experience for everyone in Badlands. 

My only last input would be, Badlands isn't other servers. 

[Tomas García]

2 hours ago, ImVexal said:

I don't see why it needs be retitled as this still follows up on the suggestion. This isn't a "general" discussion but a suggestion on how it can be balanced for those who use them for their intended use and for those who use the malicious 

I don't say it needs to have a different tittle. What I say, is that this posts aims more towards that than just scuba in general.

 

2 hours ago, errorlink said:

Reggie has been a cop for 9 months and never came across this issue, myself I haven't either.

@Drop Made a fair point and I was about to point it out myself. That someone hasn't encounter situations that aren't good RP wise, or even that they don't get bother by it, doesn't mean that others shouldn't have the right to point them out. Anyone pointing out things to make RP better or balance things should be more than welcome. And then the rest can agree or disagree.
@errorlink I agree that scuba kits, like parachutes, should stay as a valid tool to get away. But the use of it should make sense and don't ruin other people RP. Just because cars can fly of ramps and land without exploding from a cliff that doesn't mean is legit as a way to get away.  Would be great not to have to limit everything, but some people tend to push anything to the limit and beyond. And it's always the same excuse "It's not against the rules". I don't think all need to be in a book, but regarding this issue, if it has been pointed out, that must be because people are doing it and it's creating a problem.


Again, some mechanics or rules should change, but it should be in a way that doesn't hurt the legal diving.
- RP wise, I don't see the point of going around with scuba gear inside the pockets at any time. RP wise should be in a vehicle or put on when scuba diving. And if carried the walking could be quite slow. But that seems a pain in the .... for our lovely Dev to implement, and probably there are easier ways to tackle this issue.

- Making it more heavy 20Kg or 40Kg, will just hurt the legal side of it. Anyone going to wreckage usually requires more than one kit if you want to visit several and don't go back and forth all day long. That will screw storage and more if done with friends sharing a boat. Because RP wise makes more sense to go in a single boat than in many boats. While for those doing a crime, they don't need the inventory space in most of the situations so will be able to carry it anyway.




 

Edited August 28, 2018 by Tomas García
fixing typos

[BlackMagic0]

I feel like this will just end up punishing Scuba divers in the end. Those doing legit work.
Though I could be wrong.  I've never even seen someone using a scuba kit to get away from the cops yet.

I am not one though so not a ton of experience there.

[Bob Johnson]

Could it be as simple as a scuba kit has to be used within x number of minutes from purchase or it disappears from your inventory?

[ImVexal]

7 hours ago, Bob Johnson said:

Could it be as simple as a scuba kit has to be used within x number of minutes from purchase or it disappears from your inventory?

I Mean that's fine and all but that won't fix the issue...

 

What we need is 

-Detachable scuba kits

- Not able to drive when the kit is on you. - so you would detach the kit and store it before you drive.

 

 

This is the most simplistic way to resolve the issue with no impact on the real people who dive