Roleplay Before Gunplay

[Serena]

Hi guys,

I don't know if anyone will read this or care to, I know there's been a lot of in-city drama lately that seems to somehow surround the Jones' family... But yeah, anyway. I wanted to create a thread to just express my personal thoughts and feelings on things I've noticed in RP. I wanted to open a discussion where people's views or opinions can be heard and talked about in a mature way, regarding how people RP on this server.

The thing I have liked about Badlands is that for the most part, the admins are paying attention and there isn't nearly as much nepotism, favoritism, or whatever other "ism's" you can think of when they have to handle business. They keep the servers steady (we all know how bad places can be), they try their best to encourage RP even though it's labeled as a "light RP" server. The community that's here in the regulars is pretty strong and I'd like to say that our voices are heard and we're not just the peons who submit to our lord and savior speed.

What I'm leading up to is... those of you who are here every day trying to make your own way in this Badlands world, should shine the light on what a strict RP server looks like. Before you get mad and think I'm trying to change you, just keep reading! It's not because the server is strict, but because if us regulars conduct ourselves in a serious RP way, we will pave the pathways for new members to follow in our footsteps. We will bring in quality people, more RP, more stories to unfold and more people to meet. It also helps us disconnect our real emotions from our in-character emotions as well, which I feel is an extreme problem that many people have, not just here in Badlands, but in RP games as a whole. 

So many times I see a multitude of people sitting at legion, myself being one sometimes since it's where the people are at. Where the RP is at, you know? But everyone is so touchy. Soo very touchy, as if there's nothing going on in our RP lives that we must create and force a scenario with that person who is kicking our bicycles over by pulling our guns on them. Why? What are we truly getting out of this situation? For my character Serena, who is seriously bipolar and nearly psychotic (which many of you know IC), someone pulling a gun is essentially a trigger to seeing her go nutso. This isn't a positive reaction, it's a very negative one! If one person is pulling a gun, you can guarantee another person is going to pull a gun, then another, then another, and before you know it, it's a goddamn shoot-out! 

All because of that danged bicycle kicker. Gee dang it. But was it worth the fines, the jailtime, the hospital bill, the impound fee, the time it takes to deal with all of it, and the new targets you now have on your back? I don't think so. And the RP reason behind it is lame. There is nothing to go off of, no story, no unfolding of character development, there's nothing other than whoever pulled a gun on that bicycle kicker looking like a touchy mf'er who is trigger happy.

I've written a lot and don't expect you guys don't read my book of ranting, so the TL;DR version: Instead of pulling your gun on that dude who just kicked your car, why not speak and engage with them in RP before starting such a hostile situation? If we as regulars of badlands don't try to raise the bar for higher quality people (by RP'ing better ourselves), then we don't deserve to complain about the bicycle kickers of the world.

 

[Storrent]

I've been wanting to articulate this for so long, but I've never been able to put it into words. Thank you for doing it for me.

As a cop, I personally feel the "gunplay before roleplay" aspect of the people here, and it goes broader than that. Half of all traffic stops end in 140 mph chases down LS Freeway, and bikes have maybe stopped for me a total of three times in my two months as a cop. Three times. I cannot remember a time where a chase ended with an "I submit, you win." It's always a gun drawn, or a foot evasion. They get tased and booked, but they never learn. People refuse to lose. People will always pick the dominant strategy to avoid consequences, putting their OOC experience before roleplay. Everybody here is a criminal, and I feel like the odd man out having zero criminal record on the server.

I know this isn't a suggestions thread, rather a discussions one, but I feel like something has to be done about powergaming and always having to win. Perhaps requiring a test to acquire a weapons license, similar to a driving school? Just an overview of when and when not to use your weapon, the consequences of illegal discharge, murder, RDM, and so on, along with raising the cost of the weapons themselves to make people think twice about using their weapon maliciously out of fear of it being seized and them having to pay out the butt for a new one. (also a motorcycle license please they're so annoying)

[fwalandra]

I wish roleplay was taken more into consideration all across the board. I understand it's a light RP server, and I get that it's Grand Theft Auto--but 80% of the 'roleplay' I see in the city involved things like robbery, kidnapping, murder, etc, etc. Not only is it unrealistic to have that be the centerpiece of interactions among a "city" of 32 people (if the city is full), but damn does it get old. Oh, look, there he goes kidnapping someone again. Oh no, she just kidnapped a cop for the third time today! Crazy!

If we all took it upon ourselves to commit to a higher standard of interactions based off of more realistic scenarios, I think the city and members of the city would all feel pretty good about the level of roleplay found. Jumping automatically to hostility when, realistically, things can be handled in a more reasonable manner... I'd love to see this overall.

[errorlink]

I feel like people choose to kick vehicles, kick people off bikes etc to cause the drama. I myself kick Billy Cooper off his bike every time I see him but that's because He ran Winter over so she's triggered when she see's him on a bike. But this is a thing between him and I that other people don't need to get involved in. Regarding kicking people's vehicles to get them to initiate on them or chase them has been getting out of control lately and needs to stop. 

Regarding more interactive RP:

As myself I have been told to "change" my character, I have been told to log out because I am " too serious" of a Roleplayer and it has caused me to avoid interactions with certain people. My character is a schizophrenic, torture obsessed mobster. People can't handle actual RP criminals. I have been dm'd after trying to RP with someone, " Are you being serious is this ooc or ic?" Things like that and to me everything is IC. No one should ever assume RP is ooc. 

Another issue I have noticed is people purposely messing with people's spouses/dates to get them to act hostile against them. This is getting old. This is FailRP. 

Regarding Autumn:

Robbing is low tier RP, robbing is something i'd never do personally but it is common and realistic depending where you live. In regards to kidnapping, yes it is getting excessive lately. The Grey's have always been in the business of kidnapping but it was 1 - 2 times a week. Lately people have been running to us everyday to kidnap someone and i'll tell you what i have been telling them. Do it yourself. When it's getting to the point that people's RP is based around  this and they are telling you no you know it is getting tiresome.

After all this typing I am going to note something. This is a Light RP server, at no time should you force RP onto someone. If someone is telling you to not bother them don't. Not everyone is capable or willing to give you the RP you want and you should respect that. Keep in mind also if you interrupt someones RP to put yours out that's disruptive.

[10000010101010101010000000]

Well typed out @Serena couldn't have said it better. I myself have been wanting to post something regarding this topic but im lazy.

 

Edited June 3, 2018 by Skelly Jones
Im dumb

[DanielBos]

with my time in BLRP My character has evolved and currently has 3 "overlapping" personalities. I have been demonstrating the ability of "good" RP when it comes to legion. Talk to someone to try resolve the issue then show force, using force is not my proffered approach but my Purp personality is a NFG kind of guy. 

I believe we have all fallen into the "forced RP" trap ourselfs. sometimes its enjoyable and sometimes not. we all need to be mindful of this. sometimes what you wan to happen doesnt fall in line with others personality traits and we need to learn to respect this. 

I believe if we show Dannys the right way from the start, alot of them could become quality to our own RP and even friends. 

[James Johnson]

On 6/2/2018 at 1:07 AM, Storrent said:

I've been wanting to articulate this for so long, but I've never been able to put it into words. Thank you for doing it for me.

As a cop, I personally feel the "gunplay before roleplay" aspect of the people here, and it goes broader than that. Half of all traffic stops end in 140 mph chases down LS Freeway, and bikes have maybe stopped for me a total of three times in my two months as a cop. Three times. I cannot remember a time where a chase ended with an "I submit, you win." It's always a gun drawn, or a foot evasion. They get tased and booked, but they never learn. People refuse to lose. People will always pick the dominant strategy to avoid consequences, putting their OOC experience before roleplay. Everybody here is a criminal, and I feel like the odd man out having zero criminal record on the server.

I know this isn't a suggestions thread, rather a discussions one, but I feel like something has to be done about powergaming and always having to win. Perhaps requiring a test to acquire a weapons license, similar to a driving school? Just an overview of when and when not to use your weapon, the consequences of illegal discharge, murder, RDM, and so on, along with raising the cost of the weapons themselves to make people think twice about using their weapon maliciously out of fear of it being seized and them having to pay out the butt for a new one. (also a motorcycle license please they're so annoying)

not a motorcycle license but rather different categories, like choppers and sports bikes, it's the sports bikes that tend to break rp and be annoying, we try and use our choppers for MC roleplaying 

[Storrent]

7 hours ago, James Johnson said:

not a motorcycle license but rather different categories, like choppers and sports bikes, it's the sports bikes that tend to break rp and be annoying, we try and use our choppers for MC roleplaying 

All bikes have the capacity to be annoying, there's no reason to split them up. I've had many Zombie Choppers run from me.

[James Johnson]

1 hour ago, Storrent said:

All bikes have the capacity to be annoying, there's no reason to split them up. I've had many Zombie Choppers run from me.

hmm, well the bikes I have aren't even close enough to run from even the lowest cruiser and I'd hate to see them nerfed again as bad as the non street bikes i have already are

Edited June 23, 2018 by James Johnson

[Storrent]

4 minutes ago, James Johnson said:

hmm, well the bikes I have aren't even close enough to run from even the lowest cruiser and I'd hate to see them nerfed again as bad as the non street bikes i have already are

If your bike can go 75, it's good enough. We should target specific bikes, not the types of bikes. 

[Serena]

I want to bump this again, in light of all the recent gang hostility and overall player gunplay over actual roleplay. I hope it can start changing some interactions or perspectives, but I know it's a lot to read.

[Coach]

I would also like to add to this. Ive been in the city for a little under a year now. I have multiple characters who have all had violent interactions with various different groups/individuals. I can tell you from experience, the beefs that slowly lead up to gunplay as opposed to immediate gunplay are the most memorable. Believe me, downing somebody after a few days of talking shit with each other is so much more satisfying. And it usually ends up with less butthurt.

Edited April 14, 2019 by Gianni Vermicelli

[Saja Kain]

I'm glad that you bumped the thread. It was a good read, in it's entirety.

I really like the title of the thread. It's a good standard for folks to play by. Roleplay before gunplay. This is, more often than not, my approach to things (regardless if I'm on duty as an officer or if I'm a civilian). It leads to development of character and story and makes things a lot more engaging. It can be frustrating when someone just resorts to pulling a gun with no reason.

Thanks for the post and the bump. Good stuff.

[ChunkDunkerson]

I'm 100% in agreement with this. I was having fun on these servers for a couple weeks, running the mechanic shop at 2/6 primarily as Freddy.

Then like 3 sessions in a row I would be doing my thing, trying to create as many fun interactions with my customers as possible, when people would roll up and pull guns on customers or stab to death someone with little/no prior interaction. Or do some shit like "oh I'm so frustrated I'm going to just start shooting locals" and they start shooting up every NPC in sight.

Too many people are running around the city just waiting for any reason to use their gun, and when no reason arises they just pull it anyways. I mean I guess it can create some RP because I typically will call the cops, but when people die for no reason and lose their items & cash because no EMS are on just sucks.

Also when the gun's get pulled, I usually try to throw out some witty lines or try to create a funny twist into the scenario, only for the person with the gun to just scream over everyone else and just do what they want, with zero interaction.

 

I think it all comes down to what @Storrent said in his post about people wanting to win first. People go into a scenario with a game plan and they stick to it in the interest of winning. They will ignore all the dynamic stuff being thrown back their way, which could create an interesting scenario. Instead they scream over whatever you are saying or just shoot anyways. 

 

This kind of shit has really killed my interest lately. I was spending a lot of time on the servers, staying in my character 100% of the time. However now I typically am only on for about 30 minutes because there's little RP to be had. People grind jobs for money, and many of those who aren't will confuse gunplay for RP. Seems like at any given time on the server there's maybe only about 5-6 people who ACTUALLY understand how to improv (Yes, and) and look to create unique/dynamic scenarios.

[Morphiushell]

I too have to agree with this.

Me and two friends tried to play a situation where we were going to try hold up the guys doing wine. One of our guys took a guy at gun point and asked him to walk over to the wine hopper and shout out to his boys to meet up for a discussion. Instead what happened was no response from him at all but a communication from him to his boys via Discord resulted in one of his team instantly shooting our boy in the head with no communication whatsoever. Our other guy then came in to the scene to be shot down aswell. I attempted to leave the scene when they all engaged me and I had to return fire going down in the end. Cops came and one of the guys gunned a cop down.

Whilst in the cop car this also came up as both of us were in the car cuffed and he communicated to his boys about looting the wine mistakenly pushing to talk in the car I replied asking who you talking to there buddy god?? he replied  using my bluetooth.

Completely ruined a great RP opportunity. 

[Serena]

4 minutes ago, Morphiushell said:

I too have to agree with this.

Me and two friends tried to play a situation where we were going to try hold up the guys doing wine. One of our guys took a guy at gun point and asked him to walk over to the wine hopper and shout out to his boys to meet up for a discussion. Instead what happened was no response from him at all but a communication from him to his boys via Discord resulted in one of his team instantly shooting our boy in the head with no communication whatsoever. Our other guy then came in to the scene to be shot down aswell. I attempted to leave the scene when they all engaged me and I had to return fire going down in the end. Cops came and one of the guys gunned a cop down.

Whilst in the cop car this also came up as both of us were in the car cuffed and he communicated to his boys about looting the wine mistakenly pushing to talk in the car I replied asking who you talking to there buddy god?? he replied  using my bluetooth.

Completely ruined a great RP opportunity. 

That should be reported, btw. Using discord or any kind of outside communication while cuffed is considered metagaming.

[Morphiushell]

Yea but I wasn't recording so what proof can I have I mean I spoke to the cops about it they said well one at least they are not a fan of this BLUETOOTH term but a lot do it. He noted shouldnt be doing it when cuffed but it was left at that he also walked btw hopefully with a big fine though.

[Morphiushell]

I am really enjoying this Roleplay stuff however it seems others just take it as a shooter game and are missing out on all the fun parts. Its not all about you its about enabling others and their stories etc people need to learn to go with the flow.

[Serena]

24 minutes ago, Morphiushell said:

Yea but I wasn't recording so what proof can I have I mean I spoke to the cops about it they said well one at least they are not a fan of this BLUETOOTH term but a lot do it. He noted shouldnt be doing it when cuffed but it was left at that he also walked btw hopefully with a big fine though.

I don't really want to discuss this, I am just saying that it should have been reported. It's an unfortunate situation, though. 

[rEsage]

On 6/2/2018 at 1:07 AM, Storrent said:

People refuse to lose. People will always pick the dominant strategy to avoid consequences, putting their OOC experience before roleplay.

It's a shame.

Good role-play, or acting, is allowing yourself to be vulnerable. Take the loss once in a while. It develops your character and future story and scenarios.

It's a shame that people can't let go of an ego. As if losing in a video game whilst playing a fictional character makes them weak in real-life. Just let it go. Sometimes losing a scenario makes for such a great in-game experience. And it's not all about gang/criminal activities; Go find some random person and invite them on a mountain bike ride through the mountains and see what funny/interesting conversations and shenanigans you can have.

Edited April 17, 2019 by rEsage

[Reuben ~ Reckonity]

This is why I dedicated both Sanjay and Gingy to losing, they've never won unless it's been a weird situation. I hate when people prioritize winning. You gotta lose at times, don't be salty, otherwise it's your faulty. Terrible rhyme behind us we still gotta enforce stuff like this. Heck even a golden rule type system.

[Osk]

I win every RP scenario, otherwise why bother ya know.

[Reuben ~ Reckonity]

11 hours ago, Osk said:

I win every RP scenario, otherwise why bother ya know.

But you're a loser

[Merr Khan]

I'll out lose any of you, any day, Cause im a winner at losing so I win....

[KevinScott]

On 4/16/2019 at 9:23 PM, Morphiushell said:

I too have to agree with this.

Me and two friends tried to play a situation where we were going to try hold up the guys doing wine. One of our guys took a guy at gun point and asked him to walk over to the wine hopper and shout out to his boys to meet up for a discussion. Instead what happened was no response from him at all but a communication from him to his boys via Discord resulted in one of his team instantly shooting our boy in the head with no communication whatsoever. Our other guy then came in to the scene to be shot down aswell. I attempted to leave the scene when they all engaged me and I had to return fire going down in the end. Cops came and one of the guys gunned a cop down.

Whilst in the cop car this also came up as both of us were in the car cuffed and he communicated to his boys about looting the wine mistakenly pushing to talk in the car I replied asking who you talking to there buddy god?? he replied  using my bluetooth.

Completely ruined a great RP opportunity. 

Same exact thing happened to me and my group yesterday. Took one guy hostage at the brewery while they were making wine, and no one saw him. And we had another guy on the other side, someone (who had no coms with the hostage in game) came up to our other guy and just shot him in the head seconds later. Could have just been an innocent bystander. Ruined what could have been our greatest RP scenario since we started here within the last month. 

They had to have been using a "bluetooth" as well. 

Gunplay before roleplay for sure.